24 Rogue Weapons and Enchants

[Carvaka]

All of the profiles I see on this site show rogues using a non-dagger in their main hand, even though they are all sub. Doesn't ambush hit harder with a dagger? And isn't backstab by far the best non-stealth attack for a sub rogue at this level? I want to enchant my weapons, but would really like to make sure I am using the right ones.


Also, if you do use a dagger in the main-hand, is +5 damage a really bad idea instead of +15 agility for that dagger? Everyone seems to go for double +15 agility, and just wondering if the difference is that big.

 

[Hellmuth]

The leet rogues say that the damage difference between a dagger ambush and non-dagger ambush are made up shortly after with bigger damaging regular attacks + special attacks. Attacks like Sinister Strike are gonna hit harder with a slower weapon equipped main-hand.

The faster weapons like daggers have more more sustained damage and less variable damage (lower sized crits) that you don't want. Again, the leet rogues say sword/mace crits are more unpredictable/harder-to-heal-through and are more desirable in a pvp environment. (this would change pve).

Backstab has the limitation that you must be behind the enemy. When things get crazy you may be unable to get behind your enemy easy and spamming SS may be more favorable.

This being said, I still like dagger MH better and use that setup myself. It depends on your play-style.

 

[verh]

The leet rogues say that the damage difference between a dagger ambush and non-dagger ambush are made up shortly after with bigger damaging regular attacks + special attacks. Attacks like Sinister Strike are gonna hit harder with a slower weapon equipped main-hand.

The faster weapons like daggers have more more sustained damage and less variable damage (lower sized crits) that you don't want. Again, the leet rogues say sword/mace crits are more unpredictable/harder-to-heal-through and are more desirable in a pvp environment. (this would change pve).

That's the opposite of what a good rogue would say.

A sinister strike with a slow weapon is going to hit for much less then a backstab with a dagger would.

 

[#ko]

Although ambushing with a dagger will do more initial dmg the white hit that follows will be much greater with the slower sword weapon
(ie: Sword-850 ambush 350 white hit ... Dagger- 925 ambush 150 white hit)
out of stealth most of the rouges dmg comes from white melee hits not sinister strike or backstab again slower wep will do more dmg over all where a dagger will do more atcks n less dmg
the only time i use a dagger is when the efc has 7+ stacks or if my current target is running away from me

 

[Hellmuth]

That's the opposite of what a good rogue would say.

A sinister strike with a slow weapon is going to hit for much less then a backstab with a dagger would.

^^^ I was never suggesting this, unless my words were misconveyed.... 4th post basically restates what was intended...

 

[Brov]

Just use daggers, if you cant get behind someone afflicted w/ crippling then something is wrong w/ you.

EDIT: Bangalash's Claw - Item - World of Warcraft MH w/ 15agil
Sharpened Scarlet Kris - Item - World of Warcraft OH w/ Pyrium Weapon Chain

 

[Nohealsforju]

Daggers :

Toxic Revenger +15 agility (crippling)
Bangalash +15 agility (instant)

Normal Set up:
Oulaw Sabre +15 agility (crippling)
Bangalash +15 agility (instant)

Combat Hit rating:

Outlaw Sabre +15 agility
Mass of Mcgowan Weapon chain.

Dual Wielding daggers is not bad especially if it is the Toxic revenger in MH and bangalash in off hand. These daggers do same flat DPS but Toxic has a chance for an AoE poison which is good in situation although it's proc is not all that great it can come in handy.

If you decide to dual wield daggers you would need Herbalism for sure. That +55 haste / Slice n' Dice will lead your attack speed to go to 1.05. In addition the haste increases energy regen which means more back stabs. On my rogue i do this i time my life blood right after my ambush (before i ambush i have slice n' dice up).
Ambush > back stab > Super fast white hits = guy dead (if not dead) Vanish> Shadow Step> Ambush > Eviscerate > Back Stab. I have done this it works.

 

[danny glover]

Daggers :

Toxic Revenger +15 agility (crippling)
Bangalash +15 agility (instant)

Normal Set up:
Oulaw Sabre +15 agility (crippling)
Bangalash +15 agility (instant)

Combat Hit rating:

Outlaw Sabre +15 agility
Mass of Mcgowan Weapon chain.

Dual Wielding daggers is not bad especially if it is the Toxic revenger in MH and bangalash in off hand. These daggers do same flat DPS but Toxic has a chance for an AoE poison which is good in situation although it's proc is not all that great it can come in handy.

If you decide to dual wield daggers you would need Herbalism for sure. That +55 haste / Slice n' Dice will lead your attack speed to go to 1.05. In addition the haste increases energy regen which means more back stabs. On my rogue i do this i time my life blood right after my ambush (before i ambush i have slice n' dice up).
Ambush > back stab > Super fast white hits = guy dead (if not dead) Vanish> Shadow Step> Ambush > Eviscerate > Back Stab. I have done this it works.

Only terrible rogues use Toxic Revenger. AoE DoT, are you serious?

It doesn't do enough damage to pressure anyone. It's pretty much just going to unpredictably screw up any form of cc outside of HoJ.

 

[Hellmuth]

Just use daggers, if you cant get behind someone afflicted w/ crippling then something is wrong w/ you.

EDIT: Bangalash's Claw - Item - World of Warcraft MH w/ 15agil
Sharpened Scarlet Kris - Item - World of Warcraft OH w/ Pyrium Weapon Chain

^^^^ Just to make sure, it doesn't really matter which weapon is enchanted 15 agi or weapon chain - the overall effect on character will still be the same with no dps change...?

 

[Nickolas]

Mongoose.

 

[Honey Badger]

Go double fiery lol

 

[Brov]

^^^^ Just to make sure, it doesn't really matter which weapon is enchanted 15 agi or weapon chain - the overall effect on character will still be the same with no dps change...?

Yeah, 15 agil just gives you flat out AP and the weapon chain will give you around 15% hit/60% disarm duration reduction. I'm just used to putting chain on OH because you do that @ 85. BTW..some would say putting weapon chain on boa is an exploit, so do it w/ caution.

EDIT: Poisons = crip/crip/crip

 

[berlinetta]

its outlaw, bangalash 15 agi, trust me its better, plenty of studies have been done plus, all the cool kids are doin it.

 

[sevenohseven]

Only terrible rogues use Toxic Revenger. AoE DoT, are you serious?

It doesn't do enough damage to pressure anyone. It's pretty much just going to unpredictably screw up any form of cc outside of HoJ.

qft. dot tics break gouge.

EDIT: Poisons = crip/crip/crip

lol. sub rogues get a movement debuff after ambush/backstab, why stack crip poison?

instant/instant if you ask me.

 

[danny glover]

qft. dot tics break gouge.


lol. sub rogues get a movement debuff after ambush/backstab, why stack crip poison?

instant/instant if you ask me.

We didn't.

To the OP. Never go instant/instant.

Depending on the opposing team compisition use:
Instant/Cripp (minor dps gain against high armor fcs)
Cripp/Cripp (great against your average hunter stacked pug)
Mind Numbing/Cripp (really nice against teams with lots of heals/casters)

ALWAYS use cripp on your thrown.

 

[Kilda]

Also, if you do use a dagger in the main-hand, is +5 damage a really bad idea instead of +15 agility for that dagger? Everyone seems to go for double +15 agility, and just wondering if the difference is that big.

Back in the days of 29, I had +5 weap dmg (+6 /w solid sharpening stone) and +15agi enchants, meaning you could open with a bigger ambush and switch to the agility one after the initial hit.

As you can only get 1 x Bangalash' claw, you will probs want to save it for +15agility, but maybe try out Heirloom dagger +5 weap damage and a sharpening stone. The weap damage bonus definitely made a difference on a weapon with the same stats.

Go double fiery lol

Might be worth getting double fiery on Heirlooms. That extra damage is real tasty on a debuffed EFC.

 

[sevenohseven]

We didn't.

To the OP. Never go instant/instant.

Depending on the opposing team compisition use:
Instant/Cripp (minor dps gain against high armor fcs)
Cripp/Cripp (great against your average hunter stacked pug)
Mind Numbing/Cripp (really nice against teams with lots of heals/casters)

ALWAYS use cripp on your thrown.

sad part is you have crip on your offhand in each example.
mind numb really?you need the extra time to click on kick?
rogues are burst machines and im pretty sure instant scales with ap. the wowhead spell for instant says it has a chance to hit for 28-36 nature dmg. on my 24 rogue the tooltip says twice that. plus it can crit.

instant/instant/i use a gun

 

[berlinetta]

instant/instant/i use a gun

OMG your kidding right?

 

[Honey Badger]

that is the funniest thing i ever seen?

 

[danny glover]

sad part is you have crip on your offhand in each example.
mind numb really?you need the extra time to click on kick?
rogues are burst machines and im pretty sure instant scales with ap. the wowhead spell for instant says it has a chance to hit for 28-36 nature dmg. on my 24 rogue the tooltip says twice that. plus it can crit.

instant/instant/i use a gun

sweet post dude.